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Posts: 1,877Member
Joined: Mar 08, 2014
Posts: 51Member
Joined: Feb 23, 2015
Nakita ko ang waiting time sa ITA ng System Analyst kapag 65 pts ay 31 weeks na. Totoo ba ito? Tapos may mga questions ako please.
1. Kung para makatanggap ng EOI pa lang sa may 65 pts ay 31 weeks na, gaano katagal kung 60 points lang?
May pag-asa pa ba ang mga may 60 pts sa System Analyst na ma invite pa?
EDITED
2. After mag lodge ng EOI o magsubmit ng visa application, pwede bang mag resign sa work na pinagbasehan ng points ko at tsaka mag stay sa ibang bansa habang naghihintay ng invite o pinaprocess yung application ko?
O kailangan hindi ako umalis sa work ko na pinagbasehan ng points ko o sa bansa na kung saan ako naglodge ng EOI/nag apply? O pwede at kailangan ko lang sila iupdate?
3. What if kailangan ko na magresign bago ako nakapag lodge ng EOI o nainvite mag apply, pwede parin ba ako mag lodge ng EOI/magsubmit ng application kung resigned na
sa work pinagbasehan ng points ko at tsaka mag stay sa ibang bansa habang naghihintay ng invite o pinaprocess yung application ko?
Maraming salamat!
Posts: 19Member
Joined: Jul 24, 2015
Kudus po ninyo sa mga naka punta na diyan at nagkaroon ng trabaho. God bless us all.
Posts: 544Member
Joined: Oct 02, 2012
May 2012 - Revalidated ACS Application (System Analyst)
9/1/2012 - Taken My 3rd IELTS Exam
9/14/2012 - Got IELTS results: L=8,R=8.5,W=7,S=7 .. :-) .. pag may tiyaga..may nilaga
9/15/2012 - Updated my EOI = 65 points (visa 190);60 (VISA 189)
10/10/2012 - Australia Federal Police Clearance Submitted Online
10/11/2012 - FBI Clearance Sent Through DHL
10/22/2012 - Received scan copy of AFP clearance from my friend in Melbourne
11/15/2012 - Received Invitation for 189 (about 2 months after 60 pts effectivity)
11/24/2012 - 189 VISA Lodged
11/29/2012 - DIAC Ack :-)
12/4/2012 - Received FBI clearance. Friend in US sent scanned copy
12/17/2012 - CO Assigned
04/17/2013 Visa 189 Granted.. Thank you Lord...
08/09/2013 - Flight to Sydney through PAL
08/10/2013 - Touchdown Sydney
08/12/2013 - Start of Job Hunt in Australia
08/26/2013 - First day of work... THANK YOU LORD...
07/16/2015 - Transferred to my second job/company
Pray, Hope AND Don't Worry - Padre Pio
Posts: 19Member
Joined: Jul 24, 2015
However, ok na din kasi maayos naman kalagayan namin sa Mid East. I am hoping again na maka kita uli ng AU company na willing mag sponsor.
Posts: 293Member
Joined: Apr 13, 2017
Posts: 1Member
Joined: Jan 26, 2016
1. DevOps ENGINEER
•Previous experience working with DevOps team.
•Implement scalable solutions.
•Experience deploying to, and managing AWS environments.
•Experience maintaining configuration mgt.
•Previous exp as sysadmin / operations team member.
•Exact with Continuous Integration, TDD, Agile, Lean
•Endlessly passionate abuout automation.
•High proficiency in SQL and database design.
•Strong grasp of Continuous Delivery / Deployment.
2. SOFTWARE ENGINEER
•Strong exp building scalable and robust apps in a variety of languages GoLang/Node would be ideal
•Gateway queue based systems integration, Lambda/SNS/SQS a big advantage.
•Integration of downstream systems using API gateway such as AWS AP
•Integration, TDD, Agile, Lean and other engineering & delivery practices
•Passion for technology
3. TECHNICAL LEAD
•Strong exp building scalable and robust apps in a variety of languages GoLang/Node would be ideal
•Gateway queue based systems integration, Lambda/SNS/SQS a big advantage.
•Integration of downstream systems using API gateway such as AWS AP
•Integration, TDD, Agile, Lean and other engineering & delivery practices
•Passion for technology
Posts: 18Member
Joined: Jul 19, 2015
If gusto ko po mag aral ng computer programming or software development, ano po yung magandang course kunin? onshore napo ako.
Wala po akong experience at mag start po ako sa square 1. Gusto ko lang po talaga sya aralin at maging programmer or develope after. Maraming salamat sa makaka advise.
Posts: 18Member
Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Aug 2015 - PTE exam Passed
Sept 7, 2015 - Received Invite (thank God!)
Sept 10, 2015 - Lodged Visa Visa 189 - 65 pts
Sept 2015 - Police clearance
Oct 2015 - Medical Check up
Oct 23 2015 - CO allocated
Oct 25 2015 - Submitted Form 80 requested by CO
Posts: 1Member
Joined: Dec 19, 2017
I'm new on this forum and I'm looking for better opportunity and I've been eyeing for Australia for such a long time. I have 10 years+ experience in Web Designing/Web Development. I need to find a job in AU ASAP.
Hingi po ako ng tip where to start and what's the best thing to do to make my first step in applying for a work in AU. Need ko po ba humanap ng agency dito sa pinas? May direct hiring po ba? AU gov website lang po ba ang pinakamabisa? I've been applying in seek.com.au but I don't have much luck.
Kung sino po sa inyo na nangangailangan ng Web Designer/developer with 10+ years experience, pwede nyo po ako irefer.
Sana po ay matulungan nyo ako na maabot ang aking pangarap. Isa po akong masipag at reliable person.
Maraming salamat po.
Posts: 121Member
Joined: Nov 20, 2017
kasi sayang naman work experience. Thank you.
261313 Software Engineer
[Age: 30 I Skills Qualification: 15 | English Prof.: 20 l Work Exp.: 5 l Partner Skills: 10 | State Nomination: 5 | Total: 85]
~~
01.18.2019.🔹️Started my AUS Journey. Gathering of documents.
02.28.2019.🔹️ACS Skills Assessment Application
03.17.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 1 [L70 /R49 /S36 /W73]
03.23.2019.🔹️ACS Positive Result
04.22.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 2 [L86 /R73 /S90 /W78]
05.06.2019.🔹️PTE EXAM 1 [L79 /R80 /S90 /W80] -
05.17.2019.🔹️EOI lodged
07.08.2020. -- Australia temporarily suspends skilled migration program --
-- PANDEMIC . ACS and PTE results about to expire --
04.12.2021.🔸️ACS Skills Re-Assessment Application
05.11.2021.🔸️ACS Positive Result
06.10.2021.🔸️EOI relodged
04.20.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 1 [L66 /R60 /S81 /W73]
05.17.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 2 [L79 /R71 /S64 /W88]
05.30.2022.🔸️PTE EXAM 2 [L86 /R81 /S90 /W89]
08.11.2022. -- VIC is now open for offshore applicants --
08.17.2022.🔸️EOI relodged
11.22.2022.🔸️Received pre-invite for Visa 190 (VIC)
12.21.2022.🔸️Received VIC state nomination approval
12.22.2022.🔸️ITA
02.14.2023.🔸️VISA 190 lodged
02.27.2023.🔸️Done w/ Medical Exam - St. Lukes Ermita
03.03.2023.🔸️Medical Health Clearance provided
10.10.2023.🔸️Received Immi Commencement Email
XX.XX.XXXX.🔸️Waiting for Grant 🙏
~~
~ "He makes all things beautiful in His time ~ Ecclesiastes 3:11" ~
Posts: 2Member
Joined: Dec 31, 2017
swerte2 lang din talga paminsan. try to build a network, usually ganun pag hanap ng work sa simula
goodluck!
Posts: 2,109Member
Joined: Aug 03, 2016
263111 - Computer Network and Systems Engineer | Age: 30pts | Education: 15pts | Experience: 5pts | English: 20pts | Total: 70pts
.
03.08.2016 - joined pinoyau forum
12.08.2016 - Start collating documents needed for ACS assessment.
17.11.2016 - CTC'd and Submitted online ACS Assessment.
28.11.2016 - ACS Result Suitable (AQF Advance Diploma, 5 years deducted) - Sent Appeal Application
05.12.2016 - ACS Appeal Successful (AQF Bachelor Degree, 2 years deducted)
21.12.2016 - Submitted EOI 189/190(NSW) (60/65)
07.09.2017 - Update EOI 189 to 70pts
20.09.2017 - INVITED!!!
02.10.2017 - NBI Appointment - Hit for Wifey
09.10.2017 - Medical @ Nationwide Makati - NBI Release for Wifey
10.10.2017 - Medical Cleared (Both) - Visa 189 Application Lodge - Frontloaded All Documents
20.02.2018 - GRANTED!! FINALLY!!! 02 Oct 2018 IED
*****AFTER GRANT*****
20.03.2018 - CFO/PDOS
28.05.2018 - Initial Entry
31.07.2018 - Big Move (Melbourne)
.
Days Count since Lodging: 133 days - counting ends here!!
.
CITIZENSHIP TIMELINE
Date applied: 06 July 2022
City/Council area: City of Maroondah (VIC)
Online / Paper: Online
Date received the acknowledgement email: 06 July 2022
Received Citizenship Interview & Test Appointment letter: 09 Feb 2023
Date of the Citizenship Test: 15 Feb 2023
Citizenship Approval: 15 Feb 2023
Received Ceremony Invitation: 08 May 2023
Date of ceremony: 07 June 2023
.
.
Road to Superior:
20.12.2016 - L68/R70/S83/W65
16.01.2017 - L63/R74/S80/W59
*****wedding preps*****
26.06.2017 - L61/R75/S82/W72
05.07.2017 - L71/R90/S83/W74
24.07.2017 - L78/R82/S88/W80 - DAMN!!!
01.08.2017 - L72/R78/S88/W70
08.08.2017 - L73/R90/S90/W73
14.08.2017 - L73/R81/S84/W83
**********Haitus********
06.09.2017 - L89/R88/S90/W81 - YEEEEYYYY!!!!
.
.
Mock Test:
16.12.2016 - Set A - L71/R58/S56/W64
17.12.2016 - Set B - L73/R61/S71/W67
.
.
List of documents I submitted: (updated Feb 2018) http://pinoyau.info/discussion/comment/282889/#Comment_282889
Tip #TeamFeedback: http://pinoyau.info/discussion/comment/282580/#Comment_282580
Sample recording: https://app.box.com/s/au3bmauev40mvffwdq3fvrrd59yqqs1w
My PTE tips: http://pinoyau.info/discussion/comment/257891/#Comment_257891
PTE Resources:
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B2kJYAKd2peiNUMwU01IQ1Z2djA&usp=sharing
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/6364/pte-review-materials/p1
ptestudy.com
http://thevsquare.blogspot.com/
.
.
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I recommend using Stake App to get into US market. It has $0 brokerage fee, and no commission. Just pay the FOREX rate when you transfer funds to your AU to US Stake App. You can earn Free stock if you use my referral code below:
.
Invest in US Stocks and ETFs on Stake. Join today using my referral code jeffrexo362 and we can both get a free stock.
.
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.
.
11:11
Posts: 121Member
Joined: Nov 20, 2017
261313 Software Engineer
[Age: 30 I Skills Qualification: 15 | English Prof.: 20 l Work Exp.: 5 l Partner Skills: 10 | State Nomination: 5 | Total: 85]
~~
01.18.2019.🔹️Started my AUS Journey. Gathering of documents.
02.28.2019.🔹️ACS Skills Assessment Application
03.17.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 1 [L70 /R49 /S36 /W73]
03.23.2019.🔹️ACS Positive Result
04.22.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 2 [L86 /R73 /S90 /W78]
05.06.2019.🔹️PTE EXAM 1 [L79 /R80 /S90 /W80] -
05.17.2019.🔹️EOI lodged
07.08.2020. -- Australia temporarily suspends skilled migration program --
-- PANDEMIC . ACS and PTE results about to expire --
04.12.2021.🔸️ACS Skills Re-Assessment Application
05.11.2021.🔸️ACS Positive Result
06.10.2021.🔸️EOI relodged
04.20.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 1 [L66 /R60 /S81 /W73]
05.17.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 2 [L79 /R71 /S64 /W88]
05.30.2022.🔸️PTE EXAM 2 [L86 /R81 /S90 /W89]
08.11.2022. -- VIC is now open for offshore applicants --
08.17.2022.🔸️EOI relodged
11.22.2022.🔸️Received pre-invite for Visa 190 (VIC)
12.21.2022.🔸️Received VIC state nomination approval
12.22.2022.🔸️ITA
02.14.2023.🔸️VISA 190 lodged
02.27.2023.🔸️Done w/ Medical Exam - St. Lukes Ermita
03.03.2023.🔸️Medical Health Clearance provided
10.10.2023.🔸️Received Immi Commencement Email
XX.XX.XXXX.🔸️Waiting for Grant 🙏
~~
~ "He makes all things beautiful in His time ~ Ecclesiastes 3:11" ~
Posts: 183Member
Joined: Feb 14, 2012
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/10171/senior-java-developer
para magkaroon ng ibang pinoy sa department namin, PM nyo lang po ako kung interasado kau
Nominated Occupation: Software Engineer (261313)
05 Mar 2012 - ACS Application Submission
30 Mar 2012 - ACS Result : Suitable
12 May 2012 - IELTS exam
18 Jul 2012 - EOI Submission 60 pts
25 Jul 2012 - IElTS Remark - No change
01 Nov 2012 - Visa 189 Invitation, Application Lodged
05 Nov 2012 - Visa 189 Application Acknowledged by DIAC
15 Nov 2012 - Medical Exam at SATA
17 Nov 2012 - CO Assigned; Team 6 - RJB
04 Dec 2012 - VISA GRANT! THANK YOU LORD!
17 Nov 2013 - EID
Posts: 2Member
Joined: Dec 31, 2017
Posts: 10Member
Joined: May 02, 2017
Is it possible po ba to search for an IT job while on a tourist visa?
Thanks and Happy new year po!
Joined: May 18, 2016
Carpe Diem!
PTE Tips
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/comment/236138#Comment_236138
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/6364/pte-review-materials/p1
Posts: 45Member
Joined: Jun 26, 2016
261313 Software Engineer
Jun 2016 - Gathered documents for ACS Assessment
Aug 27, 2016 - Filed for ACS Assessment
Sep 14, 2016 - ACS Assessment Results Received - AQF Bachelor's Degree, 5 Years Work Exp.
Oct 10, 2016 - IELTS exam
Oct 21, 2016 - Passed IELTS
Nov 20, 2016 - Noticed error in marriage certificate..requested for correction
Jan 28, 2017 - Received marriage cert correction
Feb 8, 2017 - Submitted EOI (189)
Mar 14, 2017 - Invitation for 189 received
Mar 17, 2017 - Medical Exam at NHS Cebu
Mar 20, 2017 - Retake X-Ray for Medical
Mar 22, 2017 - Medical exams cleared!
Mar 23, 2017 - Processed for loan pambayad ng application
Apr 4, 2017 - Paid for application for uploading of docs
Apr 12, 2017 - completed frontloading all documents
Apr 19, 2017 - DG!
Joined: May 18, 2016
Carpe Diem!
PTE Tips
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/comment/236138#Comment_236138
http://pinoyau.info/discussion/6364/pte-review-materials/p1
Posts: 29Member
Joined: Feb 02, 2018
Kmust po mga kabayan, gusto ko lng po malaman anyone here residing in SA Adelaide. Baka po kasi in future dyan kami mag migrate for state sponsorship under 489 visa ng family ko (me, wife and my 2yr old daughter).
Mag inquire lng po ako, hope someone can assist and answer my queries.
I have combined 8yrs work experience as IT Support/Helpdesk position in PH and currently here in Singapore. Part of my credential, may mga certification din po ako like Microsoft Certificaion Profession MCP and MCDST. Under TRA migration skill assesment pasok naman po ung job description ko. Tanong ko lng po madami po bang opening at madali lng po ba makahanap ng work sa SA Adelaide sa linya po ng trabaho ntin.
Also, as a family of 3 magkano po kaya yung budget na dapat iprepare nmin to survive just incase matagalan at mahirapan po makakuha agad ng work? Thank you in advance sa magrereply. GodBless us all!
Posts: 183Member
Joined: Feb 14, 2012
Nominated Occupation: Software Engineer (261313)
05 Mar 2012 - ACS Application Submission
30 Mar 2012 - ACS Result : Suitable
12 May 2012 - IELTS exam
18 Jul 2012 - EOI Submission 60 pts
25 Jul 2012 - IElTS Remark - No change
01 Nov 2012 - Visa 189 Invitation, Application Lodged
05 Nov 2012 - Visa 189 Application Acknowledged by DIAC
15 Nov 2012 - Medical Exam at SATA
17 Nov 2012 - CO Assigned; Team 6 - RJB
04 Dec 2012 - VISA GRANT! THANK YOU LORD!
17 Nov 2013 - EID
Posts: 18Member
Joined: Feb 05, 2018
Newbie here. Anyone here po na working in NSW with Systems Administrator post? We are planning to migrate in OZ with my wife and baby. thanks in advance.
Posts: 2Member
Joined: Feb 21, 2018
Im currently in SG with my wife.
Nag karoon ng opening yung company namin sa Sydney and nakuha ko yung Position.
Question: ako kasi ang pinag apply ng visa ng company namin, hindi naman nila nabanggit about sa ielts. Kailangan ko paba magtake as well with my wife?
Thank you!
Posts: 39Member
Joined: Sep 22, 2016
Double check mo sa site ni DIBP sir.
https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/trav/visa-1
Occupation: 263111 - Computer Network and Systems Engineer
2016.Sep.01 - Joined pinoyau
2016.Dec.01 - Gathered COEs
2017.Sep.06 - PTE Exam L:62 R:86 S:80 W:64
2017.Sep.18 - PTE Exam L:83 R:79 S:80 W:83
2017.Sep.22 - Submitted ACS 263111
2017.Oct.31 - ACS result
2017.Nov.01 - Submitted EOI for Visa 189 65 pts.
2017.Dec.07 - Resubmitted EOI Visa 189 75 pts.
2017.Dec.20 - Received Invitation to Apply
2018.Jan.12 - Visa Lodged (with De Facto dependent)
2018.June.29 - Received IMMI assessment commence letter
2018.Oct.15 - Direct Grant! (10 months at the longest time!)
2018.Dec.03 - IED (Jan 3 deadline)
2019.Feb-Mar - Target Big move
"Relax and let the universe pickup the timing and the way. Trust God that what you want is coming, and watch how fast it comes."
Posts: 121Member
Joined: Nov 20, 2017
261313 Software Engineer
[Age: 30 I Skills Qualification: 15 | English Prof.: 20 l Work Exp.: 5 l Partner Skills: 10 | State Nomination: 5 | Total: 85]
~~
01.18.2019.🔹️Started my AUS Journey. Gathering of documents.
02.28.2019.🔹️ACS Skills Assessment Application
03.17.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 1 [L70 /R49 /S36 /W73]
03.23.2019.🔹️ACS Positive Result
04.22.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 2 [L86 /R73 /S90 /W78]
05.06.2019.🔹️PTE EXAM 1 [L79 /R80 /S90 /W80] -
05.17.2019.🔹️EOI lodged
07.08.2020. -- Australia temporarily suspends skilled migration program --
-- PANDEMIC . ACS and PTE results about to expire --
04.12.2021.🔸️ACS Skills Re-Assessment Application
05.11.2021.🔸️ACS Positive Result
06.10.2021.🔸️EOI relodged
04.20.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 1 [L66 /R60 /S81 /W73]
05.17.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 2 [L79 /R71 /S64 /W88]
05.30.2022.🔸️PTE EXAM 2 [L86 /R81 /S90 /W89]
08.11.2022. -- VIC is now open for offshore applicants --
08.17.2022.🔸️EOI relodged
11.22.2022.🔸️Received pre-invite for Visa 190 (VIC)
12.21.2022.🔸️Received VIC state nomination approval
12.22.2022.🔸️ITA
02.14.2023.🔸️VISA 190 lodged
02.27.2023.🔸️Done w/ Medical Exam - St. Lukes Ermita
03.03.2023.🔸️Medical Health Clearance provided
10.10.2023.🔸️Received Immi Commencement Email
XX.XX.XXXX.🔸️Waiting for Grant 🙏
~~
~ "He makes all things beautiful in His time ~ Ecclesiastes 3:11" ~
Posts: 23Member
Joined: Feb 28, 2018
Posts: 121Member
Joined: Nov 20, 2017
261313 Software Engineer
[Age: 30 I Skills Qualification: 15 | English Prof.: 20 l Work Exp.: 5 l Partner Skills: 10 | State Nomination: 5 | Total: 85]
~~
01.18.2019.🔹️Started my AUS Journey. Gathering of documents.
02.28.2019.🔹️ACS Skills Assessment Application
03.17.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 1 [L70 /R49 /S36 /W73]
03.23.2019.🔹️ACS Positive Result
04.22.2019.🔹️MOCK TEST 2 [L86 /R73 /S90 /W78]
05.06.2019.🔹️PTE EXAM 1 [L79 /R80 /S90 /W80] -
05.17.2019.🔹️EOI lodged
07.08.2020. -- Australia temporarily suspends skilled migration program --
-- PANDEMIC . ACS and PTE results about to expire --
04.12.2021.🔸️ACS Skills Re-Assessment Application
05.11.2021.🔸️ACS Positive Result
06.10.2021.🔸️EOI relodged
04.20.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 1 [L66 /R60 /S81 /W73]
05.17.2022.🔸️MOCK TEST 2 [L79 /R71 /S64 /W88]
05.30.2022.🔸️PTE EXAM 2 [L86 /R81 /S90 /W89]
08.11.2022. -- VIC is now open for offshore applicants --
08.17.2022.🔸️EOI relodged
11.22.2022.🔸️Received pre-invite for Visa 190 (VIC)
12.21.2022.🔸️Received VIC state nomination approval
12.22.2022.🔸️ITA
02.14.2023.🔸️VISA 190 lodged
02.27.2023.🔸️Done w/ Medical Exam - St. Lukes Ermita
03.03.2023.🔸️Medical Health Clearance provided
10.10.2023.🔸️Received Immi Commencement Email
XX.XX.XXXX.🔸️Waiting for Grant 🙏
~~
~ "He makes all things beautiful in His time ~ Ecclesiastes 3:11" ~
Posts: 1Member
Joined: Dec 28, 2017
Posts: 59Member
Joined: Jul 25, 2017
Update as of 31 Jan 2019
2019 Jan 25 - Drivers Licence (First Attempt) Thank you bossing!!
2018 Nov 22 : Wife Job Hunting commences!!!
2018 Nov 21 : APHRA Registered Nurse - Division 1 (Wifey) Thank you bossing!!
2018 Oct 15 : Wifey completion of IRON and submission of AGBP-40.
2018 Aug 15 : Husband First Day of Work Thank you bossing!!!
2018 Jul 23 : Wifey 1st Day of Classes IRON (ACFE).
2018 Jul 19 : Tenancy Bond Agreement Signing!! Thank you bossing!!!
2018 Jul 11 : Big Move to Melbourne, Australia. Stayed with brother's family for 10 days.
2018 Jun 29 : Last Day of Work (Singapore) -- Thank you bossing!!!
2017 May 15 : Wifey enrolment to ACFE -- Thank you bossing!!!
2017 Dec 23 - Wifey PTE (L-69,R-72,S-85,W-69) - Take 1 Yehey! (Nursing)
2017 Sep 17 : Returned to Singapore.
2017 Sep 14 : Initial Entry (Melbourne)
2017 Sep 04 : PR Visa 189 Grant!!! 3 of us!! Thank you Bossing!!!
2017 Mar 03 : Lodge & Payment (Me,Wifey & Baby - Yehey)
2017 Feb 15 : ITA - 189 (Software Engineer - Yehey)
2016 Dec 22 : EOI Submission
2016 Dec 20 : PTE (L-72,R-67,S-79,W-79) - Take 1 Yehey!
2016 Sep 24 : Positive Assessment from ACS - Software Engineer
2012 Jan 1 : Started to collect Employment Certificates / Plans of Migration to Australia
Thank you Bossing!!!